The Operating System Every Entrepreneurial Couple Needs

What happens when entrepreneurs apply the same intentionality to their marriage that they use to build their businesses?

In this episode, Cam sits down with James and Rebecca Lockwood, founders of The Thriving Couple, to explore how operating system principles can transform relationships and family life. They share the deeply personal journey that led them to create a “relationship operating system,” after realizing they were succeeding professionally while drifting apart personally. Together, they unpack how tools like vision planning, quarterly retreats, weekly syncs, and personality assessments helped them reconnect, dream together again, and intentionally design the life they wanted as a family. They also discuss why so many entrepreneurial couples unintentionally become “roommates,” the importance of building a shared vision, and how structure can actually create more freedom, intimacy, and connection in relationships.  

Biography

James and Rebecca Lockwood are the founders of The Thriving Couple, a coaching and education company that helps entrepreneurial couples strengthen their relationships through intentional communication, shared vision, and practical operating system tools. Rebecca is a former EOS Implementer and business coach who spent years helping leadership teams create alignment and traction, while James brings experience from entrepreneurship and family leadership. Together, they combine business frameworks with relationship-centered tools to help couples move from surviving to thriving at home and in life.

Links

Connect with James on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/james-thethrivingcouple/ 

Connect with Rebecca on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/rebecca-lockwood-eos/ 

Learn more about The Thriving Couple: https://thethrivingcouple.com/ 

Check out their book: https://thethrivingcouple.com/the-cohesive-couple 

Use code AC20 for 20% off Ninety: https://www.ninety.io/?utm_source=community&utm_medium=abl&utm_campaign=cam 

Join our free LinkedIn community: https://www.linkedin.com/groups/16297012/ 

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

Welcome to the Ambitious Coaching Lab, Powered by Ninja. I'm your host, Dr. Cam Link. Each week we explore the real tactics, tough conversations, and breakthrough moments that drive coaching success. Let's jump into today's episode. Well, hello, friends. I am so excited to welcome James and Rebecca Lockwood to the show. They are the founders of the Thriving Couple. And I came across with them. One of my dear friends, Michelle Rose at 90, had introduced us and said, you've got to get James and Rebecca on. And they have created this operating system for families, which is so unique. You guys coach families on the almost rigid part of what I would think is an operating system, but you actually have made this way for families to do it. So I am so excited to welcome you guys to the show.

SPEAKER_00 0:53

Awesome. Thank you so much for having us.

SPEAKER_01 0:55

Hey, great to meet you. My name is James.

SPEAKER_02 0:57

Yes, love it. So we are gonna jump in here. And so tell us a little bit of your entrepreneurial journey. Because, James, you have a unique background and Rebecca, you were also in kind of the business operating system coach. So I would love to hear you guys talk a little bit about how you came to what you guys are doing too in this moment.

SPEAKER_00 1:19

Yeah. I mean, if we go way back, I was running a hotel company. Uh, we designed and operated independent hotels, and I was lucky enough to have the amazing Jill Young uh as my EOS implementer. And so I learned from the best and actually got the opportunity to become an EOS implementer for several years before uh leaving and kind of doing my own thing. And uh, you know, it was interesting. I would say I got into this amazing entrepreneurial world where you get surrounded by the Jill Young's, right? The implementers, the people that are learning and growing. I was in strategic coach, and it was very different than the world that James was uh managing at home. Right.

SPEAKER_01 2:05

I I was the my official title is the CEO of Dad Operations. So I'm the stay-at-home parent. I was managing our two kids at the time, the house, the uh evening dinners, sports events, all the other logistical stuff that that's the important stuff that needs to happen.

SPEAKER_00 2:21

And I remember, you know, just feeling like we were not relating with each other anymore. You know, I was growing at a huge rate. Um, I had never really done a ton of personal development. I'd done some leadership development, but I had never really done a ton of work with coaches. And now I'm surrounded by amazing coaches. And you come home with tons of new ideas, and it's like, oh, we can't do that. You know, are you crazy? Like we've got a lot of things going on, right? And uh it just started to create this huge gap and this huge divide. And I remember I did my Colby for strategic coach, and I had this aha moment. Uh, I'm a nine quick start. And uh I sent the assessment to James and I said, you've got to do this, right? So he did it without any explanation. I got his results and sent him an email. I know ever I know all the reasons why we're having problems in our marriage, right? You know, he's a two quick start, I'm a nine quick start, he's an eight fact finder, I have very little fact, I have a four fact finder. And uh, you know, in my mind, all of a sudden I'd figured out a lot of the challenges that we were having.

SPEAKER_01 3:26

Well, I I think, you know, you had this epiphany of you doing all these great things with great companies, and why couldn't you get our marriage to work as well as that? And I think, you know, I remember the moment you came home and said, I I let's do an annual meeting. And and I'm thinking there, that this sounds absolutely hideous. Like we got to the point in our marriage where I have to have a business meeting stay married, and and it was it was repulsive, honestly. Like I had no I mean like my focus was the kids, my focus was dinner, your parents wanted to hang out this weekend, and and what's the plans? Like the like having a business meeting to plan the next year. And honestly, looking back on it now, it was the most impactful thing we ever did. Like starting to work on our relationship versus in it. Like Rebecca would talk about the the hedgehog theory, you know, dysfunctions of a team. I had no idea what all this was. Like, this is all foreign to me. And it it's been a a phenomenal journey that we've been on.

SPEAKER_00 4:26

I think life is so fast now, right? You can look at your phone and there's notifications. Well, there I've turned all mine off, but right, there's literally notifications everywhere. You know, there's constantly different um inputs, right? You know, between kids, kids' sports and school and um, you know, trying to do vacations and work and all of the things. And I think in order to really live the life that you want to live, you have to be able to be intentional and focus on the things that are important, right? And if there's anything better at doing that, you know, it's an operating system to get clear on where you're going, to make sure that you're having disciplined execution and to make sure that you're actually communicating as a team, you know, not dancing around the things that are really gonna be the important conversations.

SPEAKER_01 5:15

I mean, that sounds great for you guys, because you guys all understand like an operating system. But when I got introduced to that, that's repulsive. Like if you bring that home to your spouse, they're gonna be like, like, who wants to have a board meeting again for their uh their marriage? You know, but I think what it gave me the ability to do was to start dreaming again. Because, you know, I get so wrapped up into the day-to-day, the, you know, where we were going as a family and looking after the kids and putting everyone else in front of me and what I needed to do, I I think I lost the ability to dream and I lost the ability to like understand where we were going as a couple.

SPEAKER_00 5:49

Yeah. And I think it's the uh, you know, do I get to do this or do I have to do this? Right. It's more of that mindset shift. And I think by taking that step up and really thinking about what's working with us, what's not working, you know, what are we accomplishing that we're proud of and what maybe are we not doing and not showing up in the right way that we're maybe not as proud of. Uh, it just it gives you this ability to shift the shift your mindset.

SPEAKER_02 6:18

Well, I would imagine there's a lot of you're you're almost, I think you uh you kind of mentioned it, James, when you said you you'd almost, I don't want to put words in your mouth, but like lost yourself a little bit, where it's like you each get into your own roles where you're just going. And then you I I've heard of the analogy where you you kind of start out, you know, together and then eventually you start to kind of like drift ways. And then you're each own, you're owning your own roles and you're successful. And by let's call it worldly standards, you you have a measure of success that people would look at, oh wow, they're they're you know, cruising, they're doing what they need to, you know, they're they're checking all the things that that would measure success. But then internally and behind closed doors, it was kind of breaking down. And so I think that's I I would love to dig a little bit into what made you all kind of think of, hey, okay, we started to like intentionally work together on things and then building actually uh almost the vision of, hey, we can actually help others with that. Can you talk a little bit about how you guys got to that in your practice where, hey, we're actually gonna go and dive into this and build a business on doing this?

SPEAKER_00 7:36

I mean, I think it was out of desperation, to be honest. Uh, I think that we both um we have we both, funny enough, have children. Uh beautiful, two beautiful children. And, you know, together, by the way. And I really think that it is our children that made us really look and reflect on ourselves and say, we do not want to have only half of our children, right? We do not want to um live apart. We want to make this work.

unknown 8:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 8:09

And I think it was truly out of desperation that we are like, we have got to figure this out. You know, I used to come home and I could, I can be in a session room and I can read the room. I am so good at reading the room, I can hear what's said and not uns and not said, you know, and then I would come home and be like, I have no idea how to communicate with this other human, you know, and so I think it was a huge journey of me growing. You know, I've read this article from Harvard Business Review that says, I think it's 95% of people think that they are self-aware, and only 10% of people are actually self-aware, right? That means that one in 10 people are actually self-aware, right? And I think it was a huge awareness journey for me to really see how am I showing up. You know, I in the business, I could make all the decisions and do all the things, right? And then you have to come home and there's another person that you have to work with, right? And uh so I think for me, it was really, I did not want to be, I did not want to get divorced. I wanted to make it work, and I really felt like there were tools that were working in other areas of my life that I could start to bring and talk about with James.

SPEAKER_01 9:20

To me as well, it's like I think we started these two journeys at the same time. I I started a journey of self-development. Like I started to open the door to being life coached. I actually had to invested in myself for the first time. And as I was doing that, you know, we were going through the decision of like, do we turn in or do we just call it a day? Like, you know, I think things have got that far apart. We've been running that fast that quickly in different directions.

SPEAKER_00 9:46

You mentioned, you know, starting to in our book, The Cohesive Couple, we actually talk about being in two separate canoes going down the same river, right? And it's like you can get in your own world. You can have your own things that you're building, right? And until you decide to actually pull the canoes together and jump in the other one, right?

SPEAKER_01 10:04

Um We we were doing life together, but we were not living the same life, if that makes sense.

SPEAKER_02 10:10

Aaron Powell Almost roommates is how I've sometimes heard it, like you're just roommates at that point, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 10:14

100%, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 10:16

And so I think you started bringing back these things that worked in business. You're like, well, if I can do it in a business, if I can get the team around a vision and a dream and a goal, like why why can't we do that in our personal life? And I I was very resistant, like I said, like at the beginning. It's like this sounds terrible, horrible, but when you when you rally and start dreaming about where you want to go together, you know, all the all the you know, and I think we do such a great job of bringing in other software tools that that aren't necessarily in a business operating system, like a bucket list. Like everyone could dream around a bucket list, and then you can start building out from there into like where do you want to be in 10 years? It it's really interesting when you when you sit down and we coach couples and they come in like we we know exactly where we're going, and you ask them like, well, where do you want to be in 10 years? It's like they both have the same continent, but they're not got the same GPS location. Yeah, they're not hitting to that exact same point. And it's like until you take the time to actually write it down and flush it out, you're not on the same page.

SPEAKER_02 11:21

Interesting. That's fascinating. Yeah, because there are, I mean, I I could see the resistance. Um I'm thinking about, you know, my wife, and if I like showed up with like, hey, we're gonna run a level 10 meeting every week, she'd be like, what in the world? And she'd be like, no, we're not doing that, we're not getting that structured. But I think that that's that's there's so much value to, I mean, yeah, you don't want to treat it like strategic planning, you know, but there is a level of I I love that approach to like the softer tools, because it is, I mean, it is a little bit more of a you're dealing with there's a romantic element and an intimacy level that's a unique dynamic. And so talk a little bit about the pivot, right? Because I mean, you went down, I mean, even the life coaching aspect and then the EOS pinnacle side of things, that's probably maybe it's not as big of a pivot as I'm making it. And it's, but I mean, from a mental shift, because you're going from, you know, potentially boardrooms or coaching, you know, executive leaders to families where a spousal dynamic is put in. Can you talk a little bit about what that shift was like for you all as you interact with the individuals?

SPEAKER_00 12:35

It really started organically. So it wasn't an intentional shift, to be honest, right? We were doing this, we were, you know, having a lot of success with it. And we had a lot of our friends go, Well, what what are you doing? It's amazing. You're talking about all these bucket list items. Uh, James actually got the opportunity to go to Everest Base Camp. Uh, it was in one of our uh quarterly retreats. And I said, Honey, you're not getting any younger. This thing's been on your list. Like at some point, we need to do this. And so we cashed in all my air miles, and he he and my son actually got to uh go to Everest Base Camp, which was awesome. But it really started that way, you know, with people just asking us what we were doing. And we started running a few retreats, and uh we had some amazing uh couples come and we looked at each other and we were like, I think there could be something here. Like, this is really fun. And one of the things, it's really fulfilling work. I mean, I love the work that I do with companies, but I love the work that I do with couples uh just as much, right? It's so fun to help people dream again and open up curiosity. And you mentioned, you know, connection and intimacy. And I really think that starts with curiosity. And so really understanding more about each other, how can we use tools to um unlock parts? You know, as you have been together longer, you assume, you start assuming that you know the other person, right? Instead of continuously, people change, right? And and why are you thinking that way now? And what has happened in your life that's made you think a little bit differently? And I'd love to learn more about that. You don't have as many of those conversations anymore unless you create the space for them.

SPEAKER_01 14:17

And I think for me, I think we did so much work, like we went to therapy, counseling, you know, and they're all backwards looking. And it feels like you're in this little hamster wheel going around and around, talking about the same thing again and again and again and not getting any any traction. And it wasn't until we started like, where are we going in the future? Until we started looking forwards and rallying around a point that you start actually winning together. And then that momentum just starts creating this flywheel that just creates more energy, more wins, and then like we're not aiming high enough, we're not doing enough, we're not, we're not pushing ourselves far enough. I mean, I I remember, I mean, Rebecca jokes about it, that the the time she says, we should go, we should become full-time RVs, we should just like go out and travel.

SPEAKER_00 15:02

And I This was right after COVID.

SPEAKER_01 15:04

And I'm like, I'm a high fact finder. I'm like, no. Like hard no. And then, you know, I went away. I did a lot of research on it. And I had completely fact high fact finds do.

SPEAKER_00 15:17

I had completely moved. This was like months later, by the way, Cam, not like a couple of days.

SPEAKER_02 15:22

You'd like long gone.

SPEAKER_00 15:23

It was like out of my mind, completely gone.

SPEAKER_02 15:26

And I'm like, I I think we should do that.

SPEAKER_00 15:27

And he comes back and he's like, so I think we should do this. Well, let's try it.

SPEAKER_01 15:32

And you know, I mean, here we are, like four years in, we're calling you right now from like Colorado in the mountains, kids are on the ski team. You know, we we live very much a life of intention that we've built, and that hasn't happened by accident. You know, we spent the summer just trolling the the West Coast and experiencing all the beauty out there. But again, it doesn't happen by accident. It happens through saying yes to what's important and having a filter to be able to apply it to the things that distract you and and take you away from where you actually want to go. And I think that's the beauty of having a long-term vision and plan as a couple is you get to say yes to the things that are important and no to the things that are the shiny objects. That Becca as a night quick start would go straight in that direction. But now we have something, it's not it's not me versus her, it's us versus the destination. Like we both agreed that this is where we're going. Like, do we want to still go there or we want to go over here to the shiny object that you've said is important right now? You know?

SPEAKER_02 16:32

That's so that's so good because even in really any business operating system, that's often where you start, right? Is hey, what is the vision of what we're trying to build here? And that's so neglected. And I think so many families don't think about it that way. Where it's just kind of you get into the routine where it's just all right, got practice, like my son's got baseball practice tonight, 530. He's got to be there. We got to get dinner before that. We got, you know, it's just and then pretty soon, before you know it, weeks, months, years go by, and you've been in this routine thing, and there's not a clear direction of where you're going. Yet in business, I could tell you I work fractionally, and I could tell you every bit of the strategic plan and the vision of where we're going, where we want to be in 10 years. And yet I think most often most couples and families wouldn't be able to replicate that.

SPEAKER_01 17:22

Yet it's almost more important. And and I blame social media and I blame Hollywood because I think they all put out this this image that that relationships should just naturally happen. Like, hey, look at me, my life is perfect, my relationship is perfect, everything's great, and and it just happens effort effortlessly. It's not. It requires intention, it requires time, and it requires a a plan. Like if you don't have a roadmap and a plan on where you're both going, you're not going in the same direction. Like you're tugging apart. Like you you might not realize it, and then you wake up one day and you've drifted apart. And are you settling for the life that you've got and hoping that it's gonna get better? Or are you actually planning and like we do that in business all the time. Like a business without a vision, a plan, and and weekly cadence is gonna fail. So why would you treat your relationship any different? And it wasn't until I got past that roadblock that things started to shift for us as a couple. Like, you know, the idea of having that meeting sounds repulsive. Again, I'm gonna tell you, but it's the most impactful thing. I know that I I sit in that in our weekly meeting and I know I have to focus, we have to strategize, we have to come together, we have to align around the calendar.

SPEAKER_00 18:41

And then what I also think that, you know, that piece in particular has done is it's, you know, that you joked about like doing a level 10 meeting with your wife. And what I love about the idea that we do a weekly sync is it's given us a place to put the stuff that you need to talk about. So now when you are making dinner with each other, you can talk about other stuff, right? It's not um, it's not all that logistical stuff. You've got a place for that. We don't have to messy all that up, and we can actually now have more time to connect when we're in moments that make sense. If that uh, you know, it allows more time for that.

SPEAKER_02 19:15

100%. I mean, the structure. I I I so in my I have a PhD in communication and I studied this. This is super nerdy. But there's this theory called structuration uh by Anthony Giddens. That's irrelevant, but um, credit where credit is due, right? Love it. And so, but he has this idea where you have structures, right, that influence agents. And then the agents then reinforce that structure. So you have this cycle. And in my specific research, I studied how social media is a perfect example of that of like comment sections, you know, people go in. But I think with business operating systems and operating systems in general, that's what they do. They provide this level of structure that then allows you to go in and let things just it has this time and place. You have a consistent agenda, you have a place where you can go put issues. And I know, in the context of business, Tuesday mornings, we have a level, you know, a meeting where we're gonna get together and we're gonna go in and I can go in and put urgent but not necessarily hair on fire things that need to be dealt with. And I know that's the dedicated time where we can talk about that. And that gives me peace of mind knowing that that place is in there. And so it sounds like you guys are replicating that for families, which then I would, James, I'm I don't want to assume, but I would imagine you actually probably look forward to those meetings now. Am I right? It's the to-do list.

SPEAKER_01 20:45

You know, I I I like nothing more than our annual meeting. Like that to me is the pinnacle of like we spend two days working on our relationship and really like what does the next year look like? Like, and I get really excited about it. Like Rebecca brings in the flip chart, she we got we gotta we, you know, we we get an Airbnb for the weekend, and then we walk away from that meeting knowing what the next year is gonna look like.

SPEAKER_00 21:08

And and you know We've made really big decisions in there too. You know, we had come back off the road, lived in the house um for a year, and our, you know, we'd we'd gotten some feedback from our kids that they were like, uh, we'd rather get back on the road. So we'd literally decided in that annual meeting that we were gonna go back on the road again. So we've made some really, really big decisions, and then there it's given us that framework to follow it through.

SPEAKER_01 21:33

I I mean, if you asked us, do you argue any less? Probably not. Like, but now now I have a container. Like I sit in that meeting and I know it's not Rebecca arguing with me anymore. We're arguing about the problem. Yes, to me, it it like you take the emotion out of it.

SPEAKER_02 21:48

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 21:49

And it there's so much benefit to that. It's not me fighting against Rebecca anymore. It's not it's my way or her way, who's gonna win? It's no, it's not that anymore. It's like, how do we how do we fight the problem? To get to the destination again.

SPEAKER_03 22:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:02

And I think having all these soft tools that we again we pull into it from the bucket list to rituals, which is just phenomenal. You know, we we we go through and you mark out all the rituals that that for the year are important. Like a big one for me is cutting down a Christmas tree. Has to be on the calendar, has to be on the schedule, you know. But you bring in all these elements that I can relate to. And then there's the structure there of like rocks and what's the next what's the next 90 days look like? You know, so I think it's a great blend of a lot of different things that come together.

SPEAKER_00 22:34

I have a fun rock this quarter. So we do a one-on-one trip every year with our kids. Oh. Yeah. So this year I get to go with my daughter and uh and James gets to go with our son Lucas. And so we get to I plan and execute this quarter is my uh is my rock. So you know, the idea of like it's it's so important. Let's make sure that it actually happens and gets on the calendar. But yes, I'm super excited about that. I got the idea from uh there's a guy named Jim Jim Shields. Jim Shiles, I'm not sure how to pronounce his last name. I'm I apologize, Jim. Uh, but uh he wrote a book called uh the family board meeting. And, you know, the idea of like spending time one-on-one with your kids, no phones, no technology, you know, just spend that time to connect. So it's a really cool thing.

SPEAKER_02 23:19

It's so important in today's world, too, that I think the the presence, because there we can be pulled in so many different directions. And, you know, this little thing right here can be a very big distracting factor. And I'm not sitting here being like I'm the one that has it all figured out because I don't. Um, but it is, it can be so distracting. So I think that intention, I love that. I might steal that just as my own, just have that like 90 day. I I saw something um and I was challenged by this. But to have, you know, however many times it makes sense for you to do this, but have uh what's called a yes day for your kids. I just have one. We have one little little boy. He turns five on Monday, uh the day of this recording. So, but um letting him have just a yes day where it's like, whatever you want to do, dude. So we taught him like for his birthday, it was like, all right, what do you want to do, dude? And he planned this whole thing. He wants to go bowling and go to the arcade and then go get ice cream. And I was like, yes, dude, yes. I mean, number one, it's your birthday, but also having those in the the non, you know, non-birthday days, I think, and we're just gonna put phones away, you know, and spend that time. I think that's so important. So that's so cool to see. But let's transition a little bit into so one thing I want to make sure I mention this before we move on. You guys are so crystal clear on the vision of why you're doing it. And I think it comes from a place of it sounds like pain, you know, that you you walked through that together and worked through that and now want to help others with that. And I think that is, it's it's not, it's very much motivated out of, hey, we walked through this and we see the other side of what you can get to, and we've built this entire thing around that, which I think a lot of coaches, I want to make sure coaches hear and and understand this because you can't just get into coaching because you think it's just a side thing at the end of your career or you think it's a great way to make money. You have to have a clear why. And I think you two are a perfect example of that, of moving in every decision of how you've built your practices geared around that vision of what you're doing. So props to you guys for coming to that conclusion. Um, and I know that was a journey, I'm sure.

SPEAKER_00 25:40

Yeah, I just think about if I had had, if we had had something like this when we started our marriage, it would have been a completely different journey. You know, we got the opportunity to just uh speak with EO Detroit, uh, which is an amazing chapter. So shout out to EO Detroit. Uh, and it was so fun because there were all these couples in the room. Uh, we had some that were empty nesters, you know, and we had some that were had just been married like six months. And the goals and the things that they were planning were just so different, but uh it's it's universal, you know, it's universal. It's two people doing life together and uh ambitious, wanting to do amazing things and um just just need a playbook to figure out how to do it, right?

SPEAKER_01 26:24

Yeah, I mean, like if I could go back and look at my previous self, I I think if I'd had this at the beginning of our marriage and we'd had a plan on where we were going, we would have achieved so much more. And now I feel like we're playing catch-up. Like we you know, it it it's funny as being the the spouse that's not in the business world. Like when you start getting those small little wins, even if it's just like hitting date nights every week, like if it doesn't get scheduled, it doesn't happen. Like I think it's the cliches like what gets measured gets done. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 26:55

Look at it. See, I'm teaching.

SPEAKER_01 26:58

You know, just to hit date nights and have the parameters of you can't talk about uh work and you can't talk about your children. I mean, that is really hard, like to start with. But then you start getting these little wins and it's like we need to do more. Like, like we're not aiming high enough, right? Dopamine hits right. But then that brings you closer together as a couple. Like the connection and the intimacy that comes along with that is like 10x. There you go.

SPEAKER_02 27:29

Once you have you know vision clear, then the way we talk about it is there's competencies of being a great coach, right? And so you have vision, you gotta be clear on why you're doing what you're doing, and then moving into once you have that, then you got to build an offering that people are attracted to and you gotta go out and be able to sell it and go out there and get people to, you know, move forward with that. And so what are you've talked a lot about, you know, you have the business operating system tools, right? And then you have some soft tools. Can you talk a little bit about all right, what comes sounds like a quarterly, you know, an annual meeting and you know, weekly syncs. Like what tools come from the business operating system world, and then what are some of the other tools that you guys bring in if you can kind of show some of the soft side versus the hard or rigid, whatever you want to call it, side?

SPEAKER_00 28:20

Yeah, I mean, maybe the easiest way, you know, as a coach, right, we have to have a model. Uh, you know, Gino was uh brilliant uh, you know, at just simplifying. And so I think uh the EOS framework was very influential. But in our model, we really started with mindset as the center of it all. And I believe that you get the relationship that you're ready for. So if you want a better relationship, you have to start with yourself first. And so we've got a really some really great mindset tools around, you know, thinking, growth mind, growth mindset, you know, abundance mindset, right? Understanding where you are and where you naturally fall. Uh, because you have the the power to change that and reframe your world. So we have some tools around that.

SPEAKER_01 29:05

I think my favorite tools, the the life wheel. We always start off with that. Every quarter, every annual, you start off with like, where am I at? And you do a self-assessment. And from that, we we take a personal rock. Like, because we always put ourselves last. Like we always like take care of everybody else first, and then we take care of ourselves. And we we flip that around and say, What's gonna fill your cup this season? Like, where do you need to work on? And that's just such a we we had such great response from that. And it's something everybody can approach. It's like it's just a brief snapshot of where your life's at, and you see it from season to season, and it changes. It's like, and where do you want to focus on? Like, what's the most important thing for you for this season? Um, sorry, you No, that's okay.

SPEAKER_00 29:47

No, it's okay, right? So that I really, when I was writing the book, I was really passionate about being that, that being the very first piece uh to understand how are you viewing your your world, how are you viewing your relationship, your partner, yourself, right? And making sure that you're um improving those things uh or reframing those things. Um, and then we have some tools around connection or uh teamwork. And so, you know, things like love languages, right? Those actually can change. Uh so there are a lot of couples that have done that when they first got together, and then they do it again and they're like, man, it's you know, it's kind of changed a little bit. And uh just understanding how to speak to each other in the same language. So uh the idea of common language, right, and a shared language is so powerful. So for us, you know, the Colby was really, really powerful. But I encourage couples to do a lot of the different assessments. Um, my coach for strategic coach was Chad Johnson. And, you know, he has 11 children. So he talks about working genius and putting everybody in there, you know, in there in there.

SPEAKER_02 30:48

A lot, that's a lot of combos.

SPEAKER_00 30:50

That's right. Um, but just the idea of, you know, being curious, understanding each other. Uh, we love Brene Brown's work. Uh so you know, just bringing in some of those, those softer things and then getting into vision and action.

SPEAKER_01 31:06

I mean, I'd love to add in that in team health section, I mean, you do that all the time in businesses. How much money in businesses do you pour into like becoming a better team? And in your home relationship, you just leave it up to hope. Like you just hope it's gonna be okay. And that's that's not a strategy. That's another coin phrase from a hope is not a strategy. There we're getting it.

SPEAKER_00 31:29

There we go. I'm working on it. Yeah, and then vision and action. So obviously the a lot of the vision and action are adopted from the framework, you know, from a business operating system, right? So the idea of uh an aligned vision of where you're going, we've added uh rituals and bucket list and your big big dream to that.

SPEAKER_01 31:48

But we've also added things in like an annual calendar review. So it's like to sit there 12 months out and really but like Rebecca's schedule is crazy and it changes. And to really block out ahead of time, what are the things that really need to happen this year and hold space for them ahead of time? Is like it that is such a simple tool. And it sounds like everyone's probably sat there going, Yeah, yeah, we should do that. But do you actually do that? Right. And do you actually carve out the time and the space? Because we're so good about working in the relationship and doing the day-to-day that we forget to allocate the time to work on the relationship and actually sculpt out the things that we say are important, like the one-on-one trips, like the the yes day for your son. Like if that didn't happen this year, he'd be sad, right?

SPEAKER_02 32:35

He would totally let me know. He thinks every day should be yes day. Yeah, I think that's standards here.

SPEAKER_03 32:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 32:43

Well, that yeah, it's that's fascinating. And I I love that approach of going, I'm I'm sure there is you have to deal with certain things, whether that's teamwork or understanding, before you can get to thinking about the vision, right? There's probably do you find that I mean, I'm sure there's a mixture of couples that come in that are in, you know, pretty rough situations versus maybe they haven't quite gotten very far apart, you know, in the canoes yet. Do you find that there is a specific path that makes sense? It sounds like there is a tool that you guys start with, but is there I mean, a difference in kind of approach, if you will?

SPEAKER_00 33:27

I mean, a lot of the couples that we work with are, you know, we're going are want to go from good to great. And uh, you know, we're not therapists. And so there are we're not really skilled at being able to deal with, you know, the couples that are in a lot of distress, despite us being in distress, like we don't have the tools. We used outside resources for that. And so, you know, we're really um are, I would say that most of the couples that we work with, they're they they are committed to each other, but there's a lot of outside things taking their attention and they just need to get back to remembering who they were, what they wanted to accomplish, and they need help to get there, uh, or they just need a guide to get there.

SPEAKER_01 34:07

And I think I touched on this earlier on. I think therapy deals so much in rehashing the past, and I felt like we never made any progress with that. This is just a forward-looking program. So you you look back in the past to learn what happened, but we don't sit in the past. We're sitting on a this is a very forward-looking program. It's like, let's set a point in time, let's rally around that, let's get some wins together, let's get some wind behind ourselves, and then things, the dynamic starts to change. Like, you know, I think we have so many couples that have been through the program, and you get these high, high visionaries that are like driving in their business, and then they they're like driving at home as well. And it's like their partner's like, well, hey, I I'd like to drive the bus once in a while. Like, I'd like to say where we're going.

SPEAKER_00 34:52

We actually uh so we do private coaching as well as workshops. And we met with someone, uh, a lovely man and his wife, and they were putting together their vision together, and uh, you know, they did that, and he came back two weeks later and he's like, you know, I never thought about the fact that I needed to talk to Julianne about this. Like I just, you know, it was like I was just going with it. Like I just assumed she was on the on the already on the bus, you know. And so uh that was that was kind of a fun moment. So we love those, those moments where you just kind of learn a huge aha or insight about your spouse that you didn't know before.

SPEAKER_02 35:28

That probably happens a lot because I mean I you do have a lot of, I mean, I'm an eight quick start and I'm a four fact fine. So, I mean, you know, I I resonate. And so, you know, it can be a lot of all gas, no breaks, right? Yeah. And that can be an advantage in certain situations, and it can also be a massive liability in other situations. And so, and I think there is, you do have to learn almost how to tap into the strengths of both leveraging that in a relationship, but also learning how to like communicate that and work with somebody else that's a little different because it is. I mean, you might play that role as visionary and CEO or founder or whatever you are in your business, but you are in a team aspect, in a partnership, in a marriage or a relationship. And so I'm sure that is a hard dynamic for some individuals to have to work through. Is that, I mean, I would is that accurate?

SPEAKER_00 36:28

Absolutely, right? Because we're moving so quickly. In in my case, James is trying to stabilize, right? And so the idea of us now, I r I have to approach things a little bit differently, right? If it's a crazy idea, I might give him a heads up on it beforehand so he can think about it and simmer on it before we have the conversation, right? Or uh give him more time, right?

SPEAKER_02 36:49

And three months later, we'll decide to go on there like you're right, right, right.

SPEAKER_00 36:52

Exactly. You know, or um, you know, or I might run something by him that is crazy, knowing that he might say no and that's gonna be frustrating. But maybe I should think about why he's saying no and, you know, think a little think it through a little bit more before we just run out the door.

SPEAKER_01 37:07

Yeah, I mean, I I think early on in our relationship, I used to think Rebecca was reckless and wanted to destroy our relationship because she was running so fast. But now I think we have language to put around it. It I see it as an advantage. Like I lean into the fact that without her nine quick start, I I wouldn't do half the things that we've done because I'd be stuck in analysis paralysis. I'd be stuck analysing the details and I you know and I do more now because I lean into her gifts and her talents. And I think I'd I'd hope, putting words in your mouth, that that you see me no longer as a an anchor and like I hold this back Yes, but we get to like flush out some of those ideas and the having having a space and a time in a quarterly meeting or a weekly meeting to really flush out that idea and listen to both sides of it and say, hey, I need a little more time to go away and figure this out, like that's okay because you have the strategy. You know, Rebecca knows now she suggested this idea. It's not like it's gonna fall off a list. Like there's a time and a place and it it's captured. Let's talk about it. I just need more space and time to get to that point. You know, I'd I'd I'd ask you as well, Cam. Like you said you're a you're a uh you're a high fact find you're a low fact finder and a high quick start. High quick start. Yep. What is your wife? Like, have you ever have you ever done that before?

SPEAKER_02 38:30

She hasn't done the Kobe. I need to have her do the Kobe. Um, but she on um like strengths finders, harmony, sta, you know, like there's that is very much, so I would imagine, you know, she's gonna lend herself probably a little bit more, almost similar to what you guys as far as the split um goes, just based on tendencies. We're very similar in Myers Briggs, which makes it fun. Um, but the strengths finder, she just hasn't done Colby yet. I've been meaning to like, I have a friend that's uh Colby, I need to have him send her the assessment and have her do it. But because it is, I think that multitude of perspectives of different assessments, because I mean, even Colby's like, I mean, they're I think the only conitive test, but you do have you want to have other versions of that too, like the Myers Briggs is very helpful or version of Myers Briggs and the Strengths Finders, you know, those are unique ways. So I need to have her do that. So I will report back because I'm actually curious now.

SPEAKER_00 39:25

It's been interesting because on a lot of the other assessments we're very similar. Like we're both high D's on the disc. Yeah, you know, but on Colby we were polar opposites. So it was just so fascinating to like see how we're wired and you know, how it makes it probably makes sense.

SPEAKER_02 39:38

Like, oh yeah.

SPEAKER_00 39:40

Yeah. And it can become a superpower if you want it to be, right? Instead of it becoming that friction.

SPEAKER_02 39:46

Yeah, that probably does make a lot of sense. Like what you said, you know, you it almost gives you that perspective that, oh, Rebecca isn't or isn't necessarily reckless. It's just she's got these ideas that are gonna push towards action. Yeah. And once you have that perspective, it's a lot different than, oh, well, why are they just moving? They're impulsive. That's you know, blah, blah, blah, blah. Like it can be.

SPEAKER_00 40:08

And if I want a plan, I can just ask for the plan. I don't have to create.

SPEAKER_02 40:13

And that's like a yeah, that's perfect.

SPEAKER_00 40:17

So yeah. That's so awesome.

SPEAKER_02 40:20

So if there's somebody that, you know, is maybe a coach or even even another visionary or founder, you know, somebody in the business world is thinking, man, I'm I'm resonating with this. I see this. Like what what are what's a normal process for you all as far as kind of how do people get in? I mean, is it start with the book? Is it are there resources? I mean, what is kind of a normal engagement look like?

SPEAKER_00 40:45

Yeah, well, of course, you can read the book. We would love that. Um, we do have free resources on our website. So you can download our Thrive Vision and Plan, um, our weekly sync, the bucket list tools. So there's some tools on our website if you want to, uh, if you wanted to start there. Um, and then we really have two, well, we have a couple ways you can engage with us. So we have a virtual program, can entirely virtual. Um, it's a six-month program. And so in that six months, we help you not only implement the system, uh, but level it up, learn new things. We bring in speakers and uh we have different topical, you know, things that we talk about. Uh, we do have a retreat, uh that or to really it's a workshop, I would say, more than a retreat. Uh, and so uh we've got a couple of different coaches that do that. So uh we have one in Raleigh, I think you were in South Carolina, right? So not too far, not too far from you. Um, and then uh we also do private coaching uh for those that want to kind of go further, faster, and deeper. So lots of different ways to engage with us, you know, from the self-implementing all the way through um, you know, having a guide.

SPEAKER_02 41:51

Yeah. Oh, that's so good.

SPEAKER_01 41:53

Um and I think I wanted to say as well, I think that everyone thinks that this is gonna be a really heavy process. And it's not. It it's like a really fun experiment. Like it, like you you both come together, we ask some really deep questions. This is but there is work involved, and but it's a really fun process to go through. Like you're you're discovering like where are you going, why are you together as a couple, what are you wanting to achieve out of life? Like that dreaming part is just inspirational as a couple. Like, I I love that part of it, and I love seeing the couples come together and just form around this is where we're going, this is where what we're driving to. And there's so much power in that, so much.

SPEAKER_02 42:36

You have your North Star that you can go towards. That's that's huge. I mean, that's that's absolutely huge. It's just yeah, that's that's a takeaway for me, is just how important that is. And we make it so important in business, yet we very rarely take it to the personal side.

SPEAKER_00 42:53

So it's so fun, like to celebrate. Hey, I just have to do my bucket list trip, or oh my gosh, I just accomplished my three years in two years or 18 months or whatever. Like it's so fun to hear those wins, and uh, it just fuels you wanting to show up and be even better.

SPEAKER_02 43:08

Oh, this has been so much fun. I thank you guys for coming on and kind of sharing like a sneak peek behind kind of like the vision and how we like work through all that. That's been so much fun. I always like to ask guests at the tail end of things if you could go back and you guys can take this together as a couple, or if you want to answer individually, what however you want to take this doesn't matter to me, uh, because I'm interested in in whatever you guys say. But what is uh if you could go back to rookie, James, and Rebecca with all the knowledge and experience that you have now, what advice would you give yourselves and why?

SPEAKER_01 43:48

I think for me it would be starting with a vision, like starting with that north star on where you're already heading. Because I think when we started out together, it's like you're fueled on. Chemistry and connection and it's you know, you both got dreams and visions about where you're going. And that can either pull you apart or it can pull you together. And I think if we'd really done this from day one and had the plan on where we were going, and the plan changes like as you go through different seasons. Like nobody knows what kids like when until you have kids, you don't understand what having kids does to your life. But you're very angry. Um you always put yourselves at the bottom of the list. Like with the kids, it's like they take over your life and and you've got to prioritize your relationship. And and I don't think we ever did. And I think you know, uh we always had dreams and aspirations, but we never really prioritized us and the direction that we were going. And that is so important because if your cup is full, you have so much more to give to your spouse, to your kids, to work to, you know, I I I think to me, doing this earlier on in our relationship would have been uh phenomenal.

SPEAKER_00 45:03

You know, uh one of the values for EOS is humbly confident. And I think about that a lot in my journey because I was very good at the humble part and I wasn't always good at the confident part. And so I think the advice that I would give my rookie coach self is um trust yourself more. Like we have this intuition that I've learned to lean into as I've gotten more experienced. Um, but most of the time I knew the answer and I was at still asking or looking for someone else to validate or something. And so I think it's trusting myself more and leaning into that confident part of that value.

SPEAKER_02 45:46

I love both of those. Those are great. There's no right or wrong answer to those. You know, it's just uh it's whatever perspective. So I I appreciate you guys sharing that. That that's those are meaningful. And then the second thing that I always like to ask, and again, however you guys want to take this together separate, um, what is a lesson you're in the middle of learning in this current moment?

SPEAKER_01 46:06

I I hate marketing. I I I hate, you know, I think I think for me, I know the system works. Like we've seen the results, we've had hundreds of couples go through this program, and it's transformational. It's awesome to see them come out the other side and you hear those testimonials. But but for me, trying to understand what we're selling, you know, uh it's like it's so many things to so many different people. It's like newlyweds, empty nesters, uh you've got kids and you're in the middle of all the chaos. Like trying to figure out this marketing message, like nobody wants to buy a relationship operating system. It sounds absolutely unromantic. And it's like so I guess just understanding that message that's resonating with people. And that's been the hardest part of my journey right now, I think, is like, are we selling the drill or are we selling the hole? Like, what are we selling?

SPEAKER_02 47:01

Well, just uh to encourage you, just from talking to you and the story that you can share, that sells itself. You know, you can slave away on marketing messages, that's what I do for a living. But like you can if but if you go in and lean into the story and you have experience, that's what that's ultimately what sells. Um, so and you live that out every single day in the multiple conversations that we've had. So I've caught in that from you. So you're marketing just by sharing your story, man. You got it. Uh, but Rebecca, do you have anything to add on that or there a lesson you're in the middle of learning?

SPEAKER_00 47:41

I think it's the same one, you know, just how do we speak about this so that it translates?

SPEAKER_02 47:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 47:46

Uh and maybe, you know, so that I think I think it's the same lesson. So thanks for thanks for the thanks for the storytelling advice. I like it.

SPEAKER_02 47:54

I'm a big I if if guests listen to this, I'm a big story brand fan with Don Miller. Yeah. And, you know, just I think when you can share that, and that's what you guys are already doing. And obviously you have, I mean, you got to figure out like your, you know, your tag and all that kind of stuff. Like those things are important. But I think there is, especially in more of an experiential type thing, I think you all telling the stories. I think that is, you know, and figuring out that aspect and what the why behind it is important. But um, those are those are good lessons to learn there. They're the fun, that's the fun stuff. You guys have a thing that works, you guys are loving testaments of that. And so it's how can we get this to to the masses and influence lots of people, right? That's the that's the goal.

SPEAKER_01 48:38

It makes a difference. I mean, like I I don't want anybody to have to experience the pain that that I that I had. You know, you shouldn't have to choose whether or not you're gonna turn in or turn away. I think to me that's uh you know, that there's a there's a short, quick answer there. You can hit the easy button and join join the program.

SPEAKER_02 48:57

On that note, let's say somebody does want to get in touch with you all. What is the best place to get in touch, learn more, all of the above?

SPEAKER_01 49:08

I I'd say just shoot me an email, James at thethrivingcouple.com. I'd love to hear from you. I love having great conversations with great people. That's my uh, you know, I love that. But there's also the website as well, book a call, uh, but you know, thethrivingcouple.com.

SPEAKER_02 49:23

And we'll we'll put links to all that in. We'll we'll throw uh James's email up there. Hopefully a bunch of spam doesn't come your way because of that. Uh but you know, it is I feel like they'll find you no matter what. So that's right. Uh but uh we'll link out to all those things and and some other resources and some of the things that you guys mentioned, but I appreciate you guys coming on and having a conversation. This has been fun. I've learned a lot. I've been challenged um in lots of ways, and I just I appreciate you both. I know we don't know each other very well, but uh I can just sense the the passion that that comes out for you all. And I appreciate you all being vulnerable and sharing your story um to help help impact others um that are in similar boats because I think it's a lot more common than people probably even would care to admit or or maybe we even realize as a society. So what you guys are doing is very special, very real. And so thank you for being who you are.

SPEAKER_01 50:21

I I appreciate it.

SPEAKER_00 50:22

Thank you so much for having us, Cam.

SPEAKER_01 50:24

Thank you. I think so many people are probably on here listening that uh, you know, expected like a business uh podcast. Business podcast. And it's like we we should put our personal life first. It's like I had a great conversation with an entrepreneur the other day. He's like, I want to do my my my personal annual before I do the business one because I want the personal to drive the business, not the other way around. I don't want to be a slave to the business anymore. You know? So uh I hope everyone takes something away from it and uh goes away and plans the at least at least get your your your your annual goals out and your your rocks done.

SPEAKER_02 51:01

Yes. I think I think uh the often the the I would call them the less traditional episodes, we'll just say it that way. I feel it's the kind way to put it. Uh I feel like those are often the most valuable, the most, I don't know if uh not that it's about watches and whatnot, but I feel like those are the ones that tend to resonate with people because it's almost like a pattern disrupt where it's like, oh, that's not normal. Wow, that got me thinking. And so I think this will absolutely be that.

SPEAKER_00 51:28

So well, thank you so much, Cam.

SPEAKER_02 51:32

Absolutely. Thank you guys for coming on, and thank you all for tuning in and watching. I I know I took a lot away from it. Um, and so we will see you next week on the Ambitious Coach Lab. That's it for today's episode of the Ambitious Coach Lab. My hope is that something here helps you sharpen your craft and keep building a coaching practice you're proud of. Before we wrap, a quick thank you to our sponsor, 90. If you're coaching leadership teams, having your clients run their entire world in 90 truly elevates your work. Vision, rocks, scorecards, issues, it all lives in one centralized place. The clarity keeps your clients aligned between sections and makes every conversation you have with them more focused and more impactful. I've used 90 with over 500 leadership teams, and I can tell you it makes great companies better and great coaches even more effective. Feel free to use promo code AC20 for 20% off. Again, that's AC20 for 20% off. Thanks for hanging out with me today. I'm Cam, cheering on as you grow your ambitious coaching practice. We'll see you next time.